whats a good fist build? for warriors

[kenoob]

hi guys/girls
ive been worrying abt my build on fist (because im new) could any1 give me tip?
atm my build is enough str for weapon (using light armor) and rest on agi
and for skills i have no idea im learning everything is taht bad?
atm im lvl 29

[erinesurance]

oh man im about to go to sleep right now but tomorrow be ready for a very long post about fist warriors from Aaerdan and me (aaerdan, heavy armor build +agi/ me, light armor build fists+bow)

[Hell Ice]

hi guys/girls
ive been worrying abt my build on fist (because im new) could any1 give me tip?
atm my build is enough str for weapon (using light armor) and rest on agi
and for skills i have no idea im learning everything is taht bad?
atm im lvl 29

Your build is right enough to be uber later. But it would cost a lot. My opinion would be:

STR enough for armor and fist
CON about 100 if you want to save money or else its better to not add at all
Full DEX

This build will result in:
Extremely strong against WB/barb and dual axe WRs/blademasters. They will miss more than you can imagine and you can hit them fast enough.
Extremely weak against Magic Users. You will die faster than a normal WR due to low hp.

[kenoob]

even wearing light armour wont help?
than should i think abt investing con?

[aaerdan]

At your level? Enough AGI/DEX to wear the best glove/claw for your level, enough STR to don the best HEAVY armour for your level, and the rest to CON. Reason: until levels 60+, your primary activity should be levelling, dueling and fending off the occasional PKer.

Against monsters and other melee fighters, your Heavy armour is more useful than a high Dodge rate (for heavy armour you need STR ... your AGI will never be as high as an Archer's because you need higher STR for your weaponry, and thus your Dodge rate is not as high).

High HP is always good, especially in PvP, because of damage reduction. Not sure about PW-Int, but in PW-En-My, damage is reduced by 75% in all cases save for one (due to a bug). Which means each HP counts as four in PvP.

At levels pre-60, maybe even pre-70 or pre-80, your chances against ranged PvPers are not very good, so you might as well focus on surviving against monsters and melee fighters.

If you go the way of high AGI and STR/CON secondary, it will be very costly to play as a fist WR at the lower levels: your HP pot costs will be high (seriously, high Dodge rate isn't effective enough at lower levels - the difference between your higher Dodge and your opponent's Accuracy isn't much in terms of percentage; and because your physical defence is low, if you get hit, you get hit HARD).

I tried a AGI build right up until the level 40s ... constantly broke, constantly defeated in duels with other melee fighters (note: I'm lousy at PvP, but I lost regularly even against other lousy PvPers who do nothing but stand and whack ... this means strictly in terms of build, the AGI build was not very good; skill-use notwithstanding) and where it comes to ranged PKers ... don't even think.

From the level 40s I stopped adding AGI (I had enough AGI by then to use the level 60 molder gloves) and added STR/CON. While my chances vs ranged PKers didn't improve much, my chances against melee fighters and monsters improved considerably (in the case of the former, from just about "even" to "good", to "winning most of the time"). Higher HP and higher physical defence from heavy armour are key.

From levels 70+ I stopped adding STR, putting points in AGI mostly and putting points in CON occasionally. By then key skills, like Diamond Sutra (self-heal), Shadowless Kick (cancels target's skill) and Lion's Roar (AoE stun), are maxed out (or close to being maxed out) so that in PvE (vs monsters) the odds are very very much in my favour (potting rarely needed).

In duels with melee fighters, I win all the time (note: except when I'm fooling around). Admittedly, I haven't duelled warriors more than five levels higher, or werebeasts more than 10 levels higher.

In duels with ranged attackers ... I still get beaten because I can't stand and fight ... my mousing skills are awful.

[Hell Ice]

At your level? Enough AGI/DEX to wear the best glove/claw for your level, enough STR to don the best HEAVY armour for your level, and the rest to CON. Reason: until levels 60+, your primary activity should be levelling, dueling and fending off the occasional PKer.

Against monsters and other melee fighters, your Heavy armour is more useful than a high Dodge rate (for heavy armour you need STR ... your AGI will never be as high as an Archer's because you need higher STR for your weaponry, and thus your Dodge rate is not as high).

High HP is always good, especially in PvP, because of damage reduction. Not sure about PW-Int, but in PW-En-My, damage is reduced by 75% in all cases save for one (due to a bug). Which means each HP counts as four in PvP.

At levels pre-60, maybe even pre-70 or pre-80, your chances against ranged PvPers are not very good, so you might as well focus on surviving against monsters and melee fighters.

If you go the way of high AGI and STR/CON secondary, it will be very costly to play as a fist WR at the lower levels: your HP pot costs will be high (seriously, high Dodge rate isn't effective enough at lower levels - the difference between your higher Dodge and your opponent's Accuracy isn't much in terms of percentage; and because your physical defence is low, if you get hit, you get hit HARD).

I tried a AGI build right up until the level 40s ... constantly broke, constantly defeated in duels with other melee fighters (note: I'm lousy at PvP, but I lost regularly even against other lousy PvPers who do nothing but stand and whack ... this means strictly in terms of build, the AGI build was not very good; skill-use notwithstanding) and where it comes to ranged PKers ... don't even think.

From the level 40s I stopped adding AGI (I had enough AGI by then to use the level 60 molder gloves) and added STR/CON. While my chances vs ranged PKers didn't improve much, my chances against melee fighters and monsters improved considerably (in the case of the former, from just about "even" to "good", to "winning most of the time"). Higher HP and higher physical defence from heavy armour are key.

From levels 70+ I stopped adding STR, putting points in AGI mostly and putting points in CON occasionally. By then key skills, like Diamond Sutra (self-heal), Shadowless Kick (cancels target's skill) and Lion's Roar (AoE stun), are maxed out (or close to being maxed out) so that in PvE (vs monsters) the odds are very very much in my favour (potting rarely needed).

In duels with melee fighters, I win all the time (note: except when I'm fooling around). Admittedly, I haven't duelled warriors more than five levels higher, or werebeasts more than 10 levels higher.

In duels with ranged attackers ... I still get beaten because I can't stand and fight ... my mousing skills are awful.

You will regret this. Trust me.

[aaerdan]

You will regret this. Trust me.

You're saying this to me or to Kenoob?

As stated, I am lousy at PvP, so my choices were made based on the need to be better at PvE than at PvP, so that levelling won't be much of a pain.

And yes, I did regret ... being an AGI build (somewhat following the build you provided, save that my CON never did reach 100) until I gave up focusing on that, and PvE became much less painful.

With superior mousing skills and in-game skill-use (or maybe a levelling partner), I don't see why someone can't follow your advice about a fist warrior build.

Oh, and one final caveat: what I wrote is strictly to make levelling less painful. I am saving up for a restat scroll (redistributing stats points) so that I can turn AGI build once I can don and wield the level 90 equipment. I must maintain that from level 40x to 70s/80s, the higher HP and physical defence is vital for an easier time at PvE.

[Hell Ice]

I will explain. The whole build of yours sounds like a perfect plan, but when it goes into practical when you are at a much higher level turned out to be quite unexpected.

Against monsters and other melee fighters, your Heavy armour is more useful than a high Dodge rate (for heavy armour you need STR ... your AGI will never be as high as an Archer's because you need higher STR for your weaponry, and thus your Dodge rate is not as high).

In the first place, of course armor is better than dodge rate, but as you go higher in level you will notice that even high armor monsters can still deal more damage than you ever imagine, especially in the Diablotic and Sublime Worlds. I could even deal constant 2k damage at a warrior with 10k physical defense. At this moment you will realise how badly you will want the dodge rate. Besides, i hate to say this but at the long run fist warriors will have higher dodge rate than archer.

High HP is always good, especially in PvP, because of damage reduction. Not sure about PW-Int, but in PW-En-My, damage is reduced by 75% in all cases save for one (due to a bug). Which means each HP counts as four in PvP.

HP does not count in damage reduction. Physical defense does. It has been confirmed by the developers. Wonder how you come out with that though.

At levels pre-60, maybe even pre-70 or pre-80, your chances against ranged PvPers are not very good, so you might as well focus on surviving against monsters and melee fighters.

Which is why full DEX build is better. Now the handicap of these range users is their short of HP. If they go for Heavy Armor you expect them to deal smaller damage. If they go for Light Armor you expect them to have higher dodge and critical(Scariest), if they go for Robes? Piece of cake to you. The key is constant stunning, and making sure they cannot move too far from you. Both mage and werefoxes have defects of long cast time. Constant stunning + skill breaking is the key to kill them. As for the elves, archers have a fragility distance. Only character a fist warrior can get afraid of is priests, even with a CON build.

If you go the way of high AGI and STR/CON secondary, it will be very costly to play as a fist WR at the lower levels: your HP pot costs will be high (seriously, high Dodge rate isn't effective enough at lower levels - the difference between your higher Dodge and your opponent's Accuracy isn't much in terms of percentage; and because your physical defence is low, if you get hit, you get hit HARD).

Very untrue. The armor you equipped is actually quite sufficient. Equipment with HP regen speed is better. Besides, fists tends to punch faster, so you gain fury faster, allowing constant skill using. The only thing you should worry about with this build is lack of MP, since you are using skills more frequent than normal attack, you will want the gold claw that allows you to regen 5% MP at certain chance when an attack is done.

Will not comment on your fighting skills. HP should be pushed up by equipment, enhancing and soulstones, you should keep the stat points for better use, which is DEX. I have been witnessing a few people playing fists, and my conclusion is CON aiming Fist Warriors will not do better than an DEX build. Lower critical, lower dodge, high HP. Fist warriors are not made to tank or endure. Their goal is to kill fast and efficient without giving enemy a chance to even hit them once.

A few example of fist warriors in CN server that have done well(Forget about the names):
破坏神 - This fist warrior is the 1st ever warrior in MY-CN to reach lv100 without using even 1 hiero(when i mean not even 1 i mean both HP and MP). Amazingly his equipment has no slotted HP Stones, all are Dodge Stones. When buffed + Double evasion skill his dodge can reach 17k. I have not seen another archer with dodge higher than this. Can tank 89FB boss without difficulty.

小天露 - This warrior on the other hand is another solid prove of DEX build owns. 1st fist warrior to upgrade a fist and a bow to +12(God Executioner). Can hit a target up to 3 hits per second. Approx 28% critical rate allows him to virtually deal more critical damage per hits. Best ever kill was to kill a hiero equipped tiger form werebeast with a max 36k HP all by his own.

These people have not thought of going CON build right from the start. On the other hand i have not seen or heard of a decent CON build fist warrior until now.:lol:

[aaerdan]

I'll keep your advice in mind when I hit level 90 and restat. Right now, I've been putting all the points I get from levelling up to AGI, having had benefited from the heavy armour and higher HP in PvE for the past 30 levels or so.

(Also, I didn't write that HP affects damage reduction ... I wrote that due to damage reduction in PvP, each HP counts as four.)

[aaerdan]

Besides, i hate to say this but at the long run fist warriors will have higher dodge rate than archer.

I wanted to ask about this ... how is this possible, when fist warrior weapons require more STR than archer weapons?

(Light armour STR requirements are the same for both, so they are not a factor.)

Does this not mean the archer would still have a higher dodge rate than a fist warrior, just because the former can allocate more points to AGI (1 AGI = 10 dodge rate)?

Unless ... warriors have more +dodge rate equipment with a STR requirement that puts it out of the reach of pure AGI-build archers?

Indulge me, please :D

[Senovit]

A warrior gets 10 dodge per agi, and an archer only gets 6. So along general stat requirements for weapons/light armor, str needs your level * 1.5 + 7 for fists, and an archer would need str * 1 + 4 for his own equipment. If all the rest goes into agi, then a warrior could put 3.5 (change this to 7 points every 2 levels or whatever) agi per level, amounting to 35 dodge per level, while an archer could put 4, which comes out to 24 dodge per level.

And I lol'd hard at the guy who never used a hiero :v

[aaerdan]

A warrior gets 10 dodge per agi, and an archer only gets 6. So along general stat requirements for weapons/light armor, str needs your level * 1.5 + 7 for fists, and an archer would need str * 1 + 4 for his own equipment. If all the rest goes into agi, then a warrior could put 3.5 (change this to 7 points every 2 levels or whatever) agi per level, amounting to 35 dodge per level, while an archer could put 4, which comes out to 24 dodge per level.

And I lol'd hard at the guy who never used a hiero :v

O_O

Didnae know that.

I'm so looking forward to level 90 now....
_____

For those who can number-crunch (I'm not one of them) ... at what level would a fist WR be able to have higher dodge rate than an EA?

Also, what about accuracy? For WR, 1 AGI = +10 accuracy ... and I always assumed that was the same for everyone. Clearly I was wrong.
And on that count, what about crit rate? Is 20 AGI = +1% crit rate the same for all?

[Senovit]

Well, if the archer is pure, as in 4 agi per level, technically any level would allow the fist warrior a higher dodge as long as the fist warrior is adding at least 5 agi every 2 levels. This is ignoring buffs of course, so if you're in a 1 on 1 duel and the ea buffs himself and you don't, he might gain a higher dodge than you.

Crit as 1% every 20 agi remains the same for every class.

[Swore]

Any1 can tell me whether is it worth while to get fist for 2nd wp skill and if so, wat changes should I make to my build to fit it? Thks.